Usa And Iraq [13+]

Every war America has ever engaged in may have had pretty little sentiments of glory and compassion and defending freedom attached to it, but that's not really true. Defending out economic interests has always been the center of any major aggressive action we take, however heavily veiled. Victors' history lies, but even a cursory glance at all of our major conflicts will reveal this cold truth.

So you're telling me the Revolution wasn't for our freedom, but because the founding fathers wanted to plant corn? Wouldn't it have been more prudent then to live as pseudo aristocrats with everything they could ever want or need from the crown?

Or what about the war of 1812? Or what about the civil war? You're telling me that crippling the southern economy was intended to "look out for our economic interests"?

What about the spanish civil war? How about World War 1?

And let's not forget World War 2. We were protecting ourselves and helping our allies. Unless, of course, you prescribe to some asinine conspiracy theory that the war was orchestrated to make FDR rich. After all, he needed a new Mercedes, didn't he?

Revolutionary War was to keep the heavy taxes off us, which was our economic health. However, the taxes were too heavy for the average American back then to live as rich a life as they were used to. In many cases people were put into poverty by the taxes. That created a problem so the war was fought to correct that problem. Independence was a side-quest that occured merely to make the main goal possible.

The Civil War was not primarily about slavery. Again, freeing the slaves was a "side quest" in the progress of the major goal of the war. What happened there was the North was forcing the South to sell their cotten, beans, and other crops grown primarily in the south to the North for a lower cost than it was to buy from other countries. However, the South wanted to maintain the right to sell their goods to whoever they wanted to, and other countries were offering more money. That war was primarily about States' Rights--which primarily was concerned about money. A side note about slaves back then: Though I do not agree with slavery or condone it in any way, to believe that slaves were abused back then in wrong. Slaves cost a lot of money back then. Nowadays you don't see most farmers buying a $150,000 piece of equipment and not treat it well. Slave owners back then wanted their slaves to live long and healthy lives because that was most productive to them. Yes, a few of them took advantage of their power and abused them, but the majority of them didn't. Again..I'm not defending anyone's right to own a slave...everyone has the right to own only themselves.

World War II... This war helped bring us out of the Great Depression. The reason we participated was because our leaders knew it would do such. Yes many lives were lost in the war effort, but so many more lives were saved by bringing up the economy. Also, the Japaenese's participation in the war was for economic reasons. They invaded Hawaii and Pearl Harbor because it was rich in oil or gas or somethin (I forgot exactly what was there lol). We responded to them not to keep the resources Hawaii provided, but to keep our state and to keep it safe. We also used the war for research and to gain technology. Upon winning the war, we gained many of Germany's leading scientists, who then aided in the "Space Race".

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Yes, almost ALL wars, American participation or not, are about money or economical power, and a lot of them also had many motives, such as money, pride, freedom, etc, but a few have been fought merely for pride or freedom. Our current war in Iraq is a double-meaning war. Yes it is partly to give them freedom, but there's also an economical reason, and to deny such is just foolish.

In the Middle East, it's hard to really give them freedom. There're the few who just refuse to be tolerant and they find ways to get weapons and such. Peace is all but impossible there.

The Japanese attacked Pearl Harbor because it was the major port for the Pacific Fleet. They wanted to weaken the American presence in the Pacific by knocking that port out. Oil was the over riding desire of Japan's entire war however, though the locations where they would be able to procure it were in the South Pacific and South East Asia, which is why they also attacked countries in those areas as well. Your over all contention that money is the ultimate goal is bang on, just wanted to provide some clarifications.

Regards,

waht is wrong with fighting a war for economic interests?? that makes americans well off...governement spending on a war makes americans richer stimulates investment and leads to cheap petrol...well of course some people must die for that but hell wars have been happening throughout history...it is a natural thing :)

yes you are right, it is not about what is good for all but what is good for control at the expense of what is good and the welfare of all

I'm not interested in any of the "conspiracy theories" about President Bush, etc. But I would like to address what you said here:

"The thing that non-muslim people need to realize about Iraqi's is that they couldn't care less about being Iraqi. The citizens of the "middle east" are divided up into cultural entities and not nationalities."

This is what we call "tribalism." Common goals like freedom and prosperity don't matter in the middle east. The only thing that matters is retaining one's tribal identity. When tribes are all that matter, and people are willing to die to protect the "tribe," then there's really no hope.

What would the U.S.A be like if being Jones or a Smith mattered more than ANYTHING including VALUES? What if the Jones's thought they were superior simply because their name was Jones, and not because they were hard working and ambitious? What if they thought being a Jones gave them a god-given right to rule the world, and if they didn't get it, they would kill for it?

That's the middle east. There's no real hope.

Sorry - that's nonsense. The invasion was carried out to rid Iraq of the alleged WMD and remove a danger to the US. Read Bush and Powell's speeches to the UN before the invasion. Getting rid of a vicious dictator was hardly mentioned. It's only after the WMD failed to materialise that this has 'become' the reason for the invasion. Talk about revising history!

Clinton was the First one to give speaches on weapons of mass destruction in Irac, long before Bush

Clintons speach was on Feb. 17 1998

you are absolutely right!

US just didn't invade Iraq to rid the ALLEGED WMD..... There was no WMD and US knew it.... Talk about the Iraq-gate in 80s... Amazing how the US and Britain helped Saddam to strengthen his military..... so he could attack Quwait?

S**k my oil!

DON'T YOU GET IT?IT'S ALL ABOUT THE F**kING PETROL.IT IS OBIUSLY LOL.JUST THING THEY DO IT FOR MONEY BUT LIE WITH THE FOOD PROBLEMS AND OTHER THINGS!...

but all r made for economic intress...
n i don think will stop soon this war.:((

nicely said.

...you can't put out a fire with more fire...you put it out with water, the opposite. You can't stop hate with more hate. People. Tell me... Opposite of hate?

The real problem is that people are inherently Stupid! They are dumb enough to believe those so called 1%ers

hi simeon21

I agree with you, and now with so much becoming crazy few people take the time to think and just react. some are more than ever crystlized in their understanding of inner 'peace' first-- which is the way it must be to have peace

too long. If you guys were smart you would make your comments short and interesting.

i live in the center of the middle east,i live in Jordan. this thing u said about tribalism used to exist years and years ago i dnt know where did u get this idea from, but i tell u it doesnt exist now man. the war in iraq has only 1 reason, and that's taking over the oil there. the guy who claims he's a soldier, ofcourse u'll say it's for spreading democracy and saving the world, because u cant take it that ur fighting to steal our money and hand it to ur leaders,they convinced u of that,how else would people agree fight in iraq then?
who is winning frm this? certainly not iraqi's neither american or any foreign soldiers in iraq. the only people that are winning are the ones who have control of the new oil stealing companies in iraq,they are making serious money man. Rights of people in da states are being violated by the government and the media,they are convinced of smth which is not true: muslims are evil savages who want to kill every non muslim living, and thats not true man check this " http:// http://www.coun... punch.org/ avnery0926 2006.html" and remove the spaces. they are convinced that iraq has destructive weapons that can reach da states and that iran can destroy da states. That is simply not true! read more see the other point of view,open ur eyes!

and think that Bush admin and his conservative party gets its finances from these companies who are now in control of those Iraqi oil fields..

I totally agree with you man...

u are assassin,killer GI and die for all in irak
cop of the world zobi go in darkness
F**k your mother

If we used cheese to make everything we use everyday, build everything we live in and power everything we move in USA would have invaded france. C'est la vie - its the way it always has been and the way it always will be - go read a book you dumm ass yanks, just be happy you aint getting invaded by the chinese .. its a good thing all you guys have over there is BURGERS and FAT PEOPLE!! enjoy

And kicked the Germans out, so shut your trap, pinhead.

If the world ran on cheese, the English would have owned France long ago and they'd be saved from surrendering to anyone ever again. This would probably do a lot for their self esteem as a Country. Viva La Cheese!!! ;-)

Does anyone else realize that the reason the french were not invited to invade Iraq was the problem it would have created when you had two armies trying to surrender to eachother at the same time?

...and drove out the Nazis who raped the pansy Frenchmen. America has not been invaded. It would be very difficult and dangerous to invade America. France, on the other hand, has been invaded many times, because it is easy and safe to invade, unless Americans defend it. And fortunately for the French, Americans have defended it. About a year ago Jacques Chirac said that if any country was involved in an act of violence against French interests - and he considered oil France imports from the Middle East to be a French interest - France would retaliate with nuclear weapons. So the French criticize the USA for retaliating against dictators involved in the murder of thousands of Americans. But if France had been the victim of the terrorism on 9/11, Afghanistan and Iraq would have been craters by 9/12.

Actually the USA did get invaded. By Canada. In 1813. Although you started it. Burned Toronto you did. Stole our Beer. So we went and burned down the White House. That's why they had to paint it white to cover up the burn marks. Sorry 'bout that.
But hey we were on the same side to kick the Germans out of France. God knows those pussies never would have done it on their own. Cheese eating surrender monkeys.

Ok, I agree we stole your beer. what dya expect. Ever tried an american beer. yech!! However, few understand that the burning of the white house was a conspiracy carried out by george bush the prequel, in order to get the naive american insurance companies to pay for new curtains and carpets, as well as update the furniture. We all know it's true...no since in denying it. He told the English (and apparently Canadians) that we had WMD in the basement, and elvis was hiding there with the guy who REALLY shot JFK.

poncho villa did it too but only to new mexico and only for a few hours.

When Canadians invade the US it's more like a rowdy visit that gets out of hand. Canadians are still invading the US. I live in the Pacific Northwest, and there are Canadians all over the place. They're such a nice bunch of people, it's hard to hold anything against them for very long. Setting fire to the White House in 1813 or whenever, was going a little overboard. But I'll bet it was a helluva lot of fun. It wasn't that good of a White House anyway. The one that's there now is better. USAmericans still like to invade Canada every once in a while too, to take advantage of the skiing, fishing, hunting, and beer, and to flirt with a Canadian gal or two. I think USAmericans secretly like Canadians.

free y. amen

free you

Im from venezuela, and i hope your country will win this war!!! I got a muslim teacher and i hate him coz he hates usa. When usa wins this war i hope those amazing soldiers come to venezuela and kill the preside... you know. i love usa and usa again!!!

This is a war that cannot be won and will probably never be one.

The reason is because people are still involving religion in politics. It causes people to make stupid decisions like these terrorists. The world will be at peace, when muslim countries take religion out of politics.

n911o you rock man. the world needs more people like you.

if u know 1 person whos muslim and u hate him, then that means that all muslims are bad and shall die?? do u lsn to ur self b4 u write. y am i disturbing my self talking to u at the first place. ur president is a gr8 man, few people are left like him

just atack iran and u l get what u deserve

Eventually the Isrealis will kick Iran's ass again.

the hate you have for the U.S. shows. If we stop all forein aid to your dung hole country will you like us then?

yo va*ginal discretion i was talking about the american ppl. i neva said i wasn't one. my ppl can be be like one of u but my country isn't. so once again stop watching fox news and go to school. and about foreign policy...this country has one of the worst. ask urself y....the reason is *ss wipes like u voted another *ss wipe. i can go on and on but its too many of u and too less of us......

but more truth than not.No one want to hear that they are suckers.

you re pathetic.

What is happening on Metacafe? Every forum seems to be getting filtered comments and the numbers seem to keep growing. Agree or disagree, not filter.

some of the "comments" made are so ignorant, racist or insulting that they need to go. I think those should be filtered, also views expressed without some attempt at logic or providing at least some connection of proof are also on the block. My policy is, if I can verify the statement I rate it positive, if it's pulled straight from the posters anus, it gets filtered...unless it is obviously satirical, or funny and Not simultaneously ..hateful in anyway.

You think he gassed SOME people? Try over 5,000 including innocent women and children. Add the thousands, Yes THOUSANDS murdered in the shiite uprising after the gulf war, and the thousands routinely 'disappeared' by his security apparatus and you're getting closer to the truth. Yes Saddam held the area together through brutality like tito held together yugoslavia. But he is responsible for an estimated 300,000 iraqi civilian deaths during his 35 years in power. Let's not make him a saint now that he's dead. He rewarded palestinian suicide bombers' families $25,000 for slaughtering innocent civilians. I've been in the prisons and 'interrogation' chambers that use medieval torture methods even on political enemies who have committed no crimes. Ever see what a wood chipper does to a human? He was more than a dictator. He was a monster. His sons were worse. We have a problem in Iraq to deal with, so let's not go re-writing history.

Sadam may have been able to keep people together through force and intimidation, but he also housed terrorist training camps. What were those terrorists being trained for? The MidEast can only hold so many terrorists then they start spilling over into other countries. Because the lack of security in the USA, their next stopping off place would be here. If you want to live like those people over there, dodging bullits and hoping the next bomb that goes off is not in your grocry store while you are in it, then you need to go over there. Most of us do not want it over here. We will gladly support our troops to take out the bad guys before the take us out over here. Good grief you people, get real.

For the murders he was convicted of, he actually gave the murdered separate, almost year-long trials
before having them executed for treason. Considering he was at war with Iran at the time and the obvious attempt on his life, if the same were to happen in America, those people would be shot on the spot.

"Shot on the spot"? In the USA? USA murderers once convicted, which can easily take more than a year, then sit on death row for twleve years or more until all of the appeals (often made by lawyers that the government actully pays to defend the murderers) run their course. There was never any doubt about what would happen to people tried in Iraq of opposing a dictator. You try to make it sound like he was a good guy for allowing them to live for a year.

in year 2000 right b4 the israeli forces retreated from southern lebanon, the israeli army announced that 21 soldiers hanged themselves out of FEAR, fear of the coward people ur taking about.
we are goin through a weak phase of our history. dnt forget we ruled the world for a 1000 years from spain to indonesia. women in our culture had the right to work, inherit, be a soldier, and vote. at that time in europe they used to burn women and they used to argue in the vatican: do women have souls?
so dnt give me this S**t about us being cowards or that we mis treat women!

That's why they called it the Dark Ages.

iT'S ANY WONDER THAT NO ARAB NATION HAS EVER WON A DECISIVE AND COMPLETE MILITARY VICTORY.. ITS SIMPLE... THEY S**k i COULD PAY A GRADE 10 GYM CLASS TO TAKE ON MOST OF WHAT THE ARAB WORLD HAS TO OFFER.... NO WONDER THEY ABUSE THEIR WOMEN...PUSSIES

i think u didnt even managed to succeed n ur high school, just shut the F**k up!

worry about your own country you sod

meat eater the only meat ur eating is dick , i dont need 2 wory bout my counry its fine. mr bush is sending thier counry down the drain and they need 2 know this. judging by you calling me a sod i take it your from brittan, how bout you worry bout your country coz its S**t !.

putting your rump out there see who's blood it is.

the zionist have us fighting there war for them.

You think the soldiers look bad "...hiding behind their humvees, machine guns, helicopters, mossiles..." So where would you be? In front of them? Smart. A soldier behind a machine gun isn't hiding. He's killing his enemy. The same with the ones behind the rockets, and inside the helicopters. They're bringing death and destruction to some very evil people.

Anybody understand any of that comment?

nope

I'll bet 100 to 1 you couldn't last 30 days over there without getting your ass shot off or getting your throat cut. You have obviously never been in a combat situation. Apparently the only thing you know how to shoot off is your mouth. Get a life. Maybe you would like to volunteer as a suicide bomber.

...who have fallen for propaganda. It's astonishing that you would refer to the "Arab press and media" as an "even better" source of information. CNN, NYT, NBC, PBS, NPR, etc. are bad enough; they seldom tell the whole truth, and sometimes outright fabricate. But the Arabs have never had, and do not value, a free and independent press. But I agree with you that it's hard to know what you can believe that comes from the media, whether it be CNN, FOX, NPR or whatever. But I will listen to the dozens of men and women I know who have been to Iraq in the military, on business, or on humanitarian missions. They say that the people of Iraq appreciate the presence of soldiers from the USA and many other countries, as well as the huge number of contractors and humanitarian workers from all over the world. There is no more fear of Saddam and his pervert sons. Many are finding economic opportunities to improve their lives that they never had before. I personally don't feel that those benefits justify the sacrifice of even one American GI. My little brother and nephew are there in harm's way now, and I wish they weren't. I would prefer that we take our troops safely out of there, and leave the Iraqis to suffer or solve their own problems as they will. And if there is one more act of terrorism against our people that can even remotely be connected to Iraq, Iran, Syria, the so-called Palestine, or whoever, then we should bomb those places out of existence. It would be a horrible, ugly thing to have to do, but not as horrible as having innocent people of our own murdered and maimed by the minority of Muslims who are terrorists and are sheltered and supported by many of the oil-rich people and politicians in those countries.

And perhaps you should talk to someone who's been in Iraq. The vast majority of the people love us there.

Even the Sunnis. Stop devouring the garbage you see on t.v.

Perhaps you should broaden your narrow minded perspective and check the foreign, or even better, the Arab press and media. Stop feeding yourself with Fox news crap and most importantly stop devouring the " Green Zone" propaganda.

This people are ignorant!!
and easy to control by any crazy dictator!
And with availability of nuclear weapons and weapons of mass distructions available to the highest bidder THEY BECOME A THREAT TO THE WORLD!!
Thank GOD for America and England troops who were the only ones with the balls to put a stop to this dictators evil desires of conquer and kill!
And are still fighting coward evil insurgents who are Muslim extremist and are against peace and the region estabilization!!
Together with the Iraqui people hopefully somethinbg possitive happens! even though I think there is no teaching an old dog new tricks!!

Why they advanced the Doomsday Clock. It's because too many ridiculous countries with ridiculous dictators have access to nuclear weapons.

I think those "ridiculous dictators" take one look at our own ridiculous oligarchy, loaded with enough nukes to destroy the world many times over, and think they should probably have some type of protection from us {i.e. a nuke of their own}