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Mig-29 kick ass
But I think that was just a Mig29 stunt team - No F16s anywhere to be seen.
By devonutopia 1171143306There weren't any Falcons at all in this vid, just Fulcrums.
By Raptorcat 1200623386aircraft of the same generation look similar. biplanes then mono f86 and mig 15 ect.
By S_c_burke 1182495010Mig 29 have already shot down some f16s in Indian,usa military games in India
By nimamaffia 1177066585the numbers in the games against f16 and f15 was close to 9 to 1 in favour of the migs. about the same time the airforce is in front of a senate commite asking for money for the raptor. so how do you spell political suicide? tell the american public that you are putting thier pilots in an aircraft where they are probably going to die at a rate of 9 to 1.
By S_c_burke 1182494936It is really hard to say for certain which one is better but in the past history shows the more advanced American built fighters as the victors. The F16 has so many buyers with different packages its hard to say. In the early days of the F16 it was build using a honey comb mesh and a fiber glue. That early model was rated up to 9 g's. Later models are using a carbon fiber advanced composite that is 22% stronger. These models came out in 1993 and later. So that puts the air frame near 13 g's. The avionics in some buyers packages are far better than others. The us built this plane for a fighter but then put so many demands on the plane that later blocks were heavier and geared for anti radiation missions. The F16l sufa made for Israel cost more than 70 million and is far superior to the US model and any mig 29 ever mass produced. I worked with a block 50/52 with advanced FLIR and longer range bvr devices. It had slightly larger wing surfaces and was very very good in a dog fight. The main issue with the F16 is that is had a very long hang time. It can go farther than even the F15 on a tank of fuel. It was fast, long range, and good enough to defend itself when needed. The government noticed its long range and decided it would be best used and a stable anti radiation fighter. It also used a helmet display in unison with the hud. It has an inclined seat for high g's, the stick can switch all weapons, screen functions, deploy IR decoys, and was located on the side not between your legs. This have us additional room for look down avionics and other stuff. Its packed full of goodies to say the least. A lot of the test beds for other aircraft derived from the F16 frame.
The US F16 has a mild combat record due to the fact the F15 shot down most of the aircraft sent to silent the American air ground attacks. I know it is going to be a long lived fighter besides the fact the F22 is out. The F22 and F35 are most likely surgical tools used at the tip of the spear. The 5000 or so F16 and F15 will still bear the load of work horse for another 20 years I can see it for sure.
The Americans experimented in thrust vectoring like in the Su27 but deemed that the amount of thrust control and more advanced avionics in the F16 and F15 made up for the lack of low speed turning as compared to the Russian plane. The mig 29 lacked digital FBW abilities and the engines smoked like campfires. The F15 and F16 both have nozzles on the engines that move 3.5 degrees in any direction and sense we had the ability to use lighter weight composites in construction our planes turned much faster at "combat speeds". Not at low speeds like the Su27 that used titanium for construction. The ability to turn fast at low speeds is nice in some cases like shooting down helicopters or slow planes like the A10 or bombers. The P51 mustang can run at 240 miles per hour and turn like an Su27 does that mean it is better than the F16? Not quite. Now for the more modern Russian planes that were produced in limited numbers. They show promise the be able to out turn and handle anything the Eagle or Viper can throw at them. Those planes are again very limited in production and cost a lot of money. The F22 is far more advanced than those planes as of date. I know that stealth works. I know that avionics make a large world of difference. The German pilots that faced the 457 FS from Forth Worth were out done 4 to one on practice air battles. The BVR of the Viper was far better than the mig 29. The helmet sight on the mig 29 was very stunning but the Americans learned to keep speed up and pull high speed role outs, keep energy high, and the mig would bleed off energy every time giving up the advantage to the USAF. I imagine with a fbw system and some of the newer Russian avionics it would have been better for the Germans. In no way would any F16 pilot slow down to those low speeds to turn with a mig. Why would you when you could go vertical, push over, role out and get a solution to fire. Notice that hardly ever to you hear of a gun kill. Its all avionics, electronics, missiles and high speed turns. I would have loved to see the Israel version of the F16. It has a more advanced computer, longer fuel range and more powerful engines. It is all jacked up for a fight. I think we will see it in action soon against Iran. I think it will again show its superior ability.
Everyone things eagles and falcons (vipers) cant turn. This video is junk and misleading the truth. In the mid 90's the f-15 and f-16 were fitted with nozzles giving them thrust deflection and super turning ability. I have done the helicopter in my eagle, reverse split s in less than 10,000 feet. We can turn with anything they have. Someone said we cant pull more than 6 g's in an eagle, well in red flag some guys pulled over 12 g's in an eagle. Same with Viper pilots. Its funny how the russian planes have been shot out of the air for years by us. They had great support from ground tracking stations, doppler broadband support from the soviets. Well we splashed 10 mig 29's in Serbia and lost none. One was even in a turning fight. Funny how that magical eagle out turned that mig 29 enough to get a firing solution.
The US owns sever mig 29's. We practiced against them all the time in the dessert. NOT an issue. Now for a reversed winged trashcan they claim is so great. We built those kinds of planes in the early 80's. At slow speeds they can turn. At high speeds they flounder. I wouldnt put to much stress on those things. As for magical plasma stealth. Plasma is hot ionized gas. When they turn that on it will glow in the dark on any IR tracker. Eagles have used IR sense 1081. Oh and in real life a weapons lock does not mean a kill. They call them missiles not hittiles. The f15 isnt the fastest plane in the sky, but its fast enough, turns good enough, and with its still better than yours weps. Its still the big dog on the block.
Well the new f22 is a great plane. I dont fly now due to my high blood pressure, but my friend couldnt even get a lock from the six on a rapter. I wish I was younger and had the opportunity to fly one.
The Russians have always claimed to have the answer to the Eagle but it never panned out for them. The Serbian airforce used to be a part of the USSR. They had top of the line g2a systems, planes and pilots. No one wants to believe that we are just that damn good. Guess what, we are even better than that. I pulled J turns all the time in my eagle. The Ealge can turn with just about anything in the sky. Two hornets out turned and splashed two mig 29's in GW1, and they had a full combat load on the wings. Those marines after shooting down the trash cans flew on to bomb targets in inner Iraq.
Everyone always argues, "if you remove the weapons system advantages of the eagle the fight would be more fair". Well that is stupid to say, the systems on an eagle are all the perfect blend to make an outstanding mig killer.
What you read or play on playstation or game cube isn't near close to seeing what is real. I drove and eagle and a viper. They bot turn real nice, and quite frankly my last red flag involved mig 29's from germany. They put limits on our speeds and altitudes just to keep it close for the migs. Study up on dog fighting. Altitude is free speed, and the ability to engage at any time you feel ready. Yes at low speeds they out turn us barley, but why do you think we do roles. We do latter jumps and seesaws to keep up our air speed. We are moving at 2 times the speed of the mig and covering the same ground keeping us able to out turn them. Then we just straiten out and we at high speed. All i can say is back to the drawing board on those migs. I do think the helmet sight looks cool but hasnt really proven itself yet. It does tunnel vision the pilot and hurts sa a bit in my mind. I dont need to aim my weps my computer gets the solution. They just need some high quality Japan made computers and maybe they will compete.
History shows we are years ahead of them. In every way. Our military is only rivaled by the our Jewish friends in the middle east. They can actually deliver more sorties a day than us. They have geared up higher tech vipers and eagles. They have an advanced nave not like the rusty old junk Russia puts in the water. Get with the facts.
First thing human body can`t whitstand 12 g in any aircraft. MiG 29 has an airframe limit of 12g and F15 has a limit of 12g. Second thing Serbia EX Yugoslavia was never a part of USSR hence their airforce wasn`t a part of USSR`s airforce. Third thing it is nice to fight against a weaker country like Yugoslavia or Iraq. Try to attack Iran or Russia and then you will see your precious eagles....
And last thing because lots of people mix something MiG 29 is not the same class like F 15, Russian answer to F 15 is Su 27. Putting an F 15 against MiG 29 is just like putting a heavyweight boxer against a middleweight boxer.
And it would be nice to actualy read some info before posting.
Sorry for my English
Watch the history channel astronauts do it all the time. John Glen bulled 12 gs on re-entry. As for attacking a weaker country and not Iran. Well Iraq beat Iran in the Iraq Iran war. Again history lesson needed. I know Serbia was not a part of the USSR it was in the warsaw pact. The 8th Russian Army Air wing was stationed in that country. Meaning that the Serbian airforce was Soviet for a good period of time. Also it would be hard for the US to find a country that is not weaker than it is. Russia is far weaker than the us. Isrial is most likely the only country on earth to have a similar military. I never said humans could pull 12 g's all day long. I myself got sick at 9 g's but have pulled more than nine g's but its not my favorite thing.
Just in the past few months Russia has publicly stated that its airforce and conventional military is no match for the USA. It said it would have to use special weapons (nukes) to combat us. Its no secret that is the case.
Your 1980 technology is not going to compete with an F-22 sorry. Russians got a tromping in Afganistan by the same people we rolled over in less than a weeks time. I think it has a lot to do with our airforce and its ability to operate in any situation and climate, and just plane being better. I know Russian claims to have these new super planes, but they always have done that. Real life shows that they got splashed just like the rest. Vietnam is over boys, we learned a lot from that war. Our planes are better, our pilots are better. The human body can do 12 g's cosmonauts do it all the time, Russian pilots do it all the time, US airforce pilots do it all the time. I guess if you take away the superior computer power of the Eagle or the Viper and allowed the Russians to keep us at slower speeds and not to use our training and counter Soviet tactics, yes it would be a good fight. They still use the same tactical training as always. They think they can blow chaff, do a half reverse split S stay low on full burner and trick our look down shoot down. It isnt going to work no matter what plane your in other than stealth. And for a turning fight, its hard to get us into a turning fight, and in all incidents that it has happend, we still won. Eagles out turned 29's in Iraq and Serbia. Again Iran prefers the use of F14's over any of the Russian junk. So why would you think your junk is better? They even contracted Russia to build a copy of the phoenix air to air and other spare parts so they can still use them.
Iraq was stronger than Iran, and Serbia. Russia is a power house but not near the US and it knows it. If Russia is so bad, why didnt it keep those nukes in Cuba? Out of fear thats why duh. They have only 8 long range boats in the Russian navy. None of those are carriers they dont have the money to keep them afloat. So go hit the books. Look at history, look at reality and then come back and show me some facts on how Russian planes and military is better. I love facts not rubbish.
Yugoslavia was not part of an warsaw pact. Please read some history. Why I know about this you may ask is because I`m living near Serbia and I know that never and I mean never was any Soviet Airforce station in the Yugoslavia or Serbia. And for other stuf you wrote hear only in your dreams. Sorry if I have insulted you.
By duf 1228246090The Soviet Union assumed the role of Albania's principal benefactor from late 1948. Albania was a founder member of the Warsaw Pact in 1955, and its security was guaranteed against Yugoslav encroachment by its participation in the Soviet-led collective security system until 1961. However, the Soviet Union suspended its military cooperation and security guarantees when Albania supported China in the Sino-Soviet split.
This was taken from the Serbian national archives. So your wrong and a insulted yourself. The human body can take 12 g's and some people do pass out at 6. It is all up the the pilot and how much they weight train. Its history you cant rewrite it to fit your needs. Redbull pilots pull 12 g's at air shows daily. I served in a real military, I retired from a real military as you must not really live near where you say. Or you would have known the history of Serbia. Sorry our Airforce has been and always will be better than Russia's. I know for a fact that Soviets operated in Serbia, they still had an active rail way there when it was used to take a stealth fighter back to the mother land for inspection after being shot down. It pains you to see the truth. They were in the Warsaw pact. It is written in Soviet history books and in Ygoslavia history. I am sorry if I have insulted you for being wrong again.
Do you know what is 12g???? Human body passes out on 6g-7g. It seems that you are not a pilot but a wanna be a pilot who has looked to many Top Gun movies and played for to long Lock On or Microsoft Flight simulator and still don`t know the difference of MiG 29 and Su 27. What computing power of an Eagle, Eagle`s never used their radar`s but only data link of an awacs. And how many F 22 is going to be built 500 or maybe 200. Have you heard about MiG 31 real interceptor? As I recall that story about Russia could not win a battle against USA is 13 years old. Oh yes and one other thing if The 8th Russian Army Air wing was stationed in Serbia they would also have an S-300p or pm air defence system installed so it would make your life a living hell.
By duf 1228263060The G suits issued to US pilots are rated at 9 g's Now you can pull more pos g's than neg g's. There is also transverse g's that the astronauts do. I know all about g's. I never really watched TOP Gun it was a navy movie. The Russian S0-300 g2a defense system was used in that war. It was not fun they downs some of our planes but not enough. I imagine it was more hell on the ground loosing all that life. It was not called the 8th Russian Army air force when it was Soviet led. If you know so much what was it called at that time? I know do you? Oh our anti radiation missions proved to be most effective against Russian tracking stations. If Russia's military is so powerful, and it is so much better to respond and has so many more resources, why is it that every time something bad in the world happens. The world cries for the USA to help?
As for the S-300 the Tor-M1 missile system is Russia's most advanced and is highly sought after. It downed an F16 and a stealth fighter. I flew against them and made it out alive. I guess it all is in the pudding. The S300 has a larger range than the Tor-M1 but the Tor M1 has a lower freq Radiar meaning it can track planes that have stealth like qualities. It was common practice for us to learn about Russian equipment. I know more about it than you do. As for Serbia not being in the Warsaw pact they were one of the founding countries. They pulled out but then again you would have known that right? History is written you cant change it by saying "well if you" and "not if" and junk. I know all about g forces I know about how it feels, I know the taste it puts in your mouth. I have crushed teeth in high pulls. I have done it all my friend.
As for the mystical Mig 31 has it ever been tested in combat? How many F15s are in the US bad of goodies. How many F22's I dont know. I know they plan to have more F35's than F22's so I imagine those will be more mass produced. I know the diff between a mig 29 and an Su 27. Why is that important here. Do you know the stall rate in turn for the rocket used int the S-300? I do! I have never played on Microsoft flight or any of that junk. I imagine you live a sheltered life. You watched as the iron curtain fell and your country lost Germany to us. Then watched as we rolled over Iraq with all of its Russian equipment. Oh in that war one F15 pilot splashed downed two mig 29s. One was in a turning fight. How was that possible? He was out numbered and the Mig 29 was supposed to out fly him? I know that you claim the Su27 was widely used by the Russian navy via carrier based. It was developed to match the F14, F16, and the early F15. It is visibly larger than the mig 29. I dont want to go all into what I know but its supposed to be a nice plane there is one at the Dayton Airforce museum next to a mig 29. I know that at low speeds they are said to have 120 degree attack angle but no one flies that slow in a dog fight. I know it would work against choppers. It has a small bubble compared to the Viper or the Eagle. It is what it is. I know the dif do you? I also know its main role was to fight its way to the rear and shoot down american tankers and awacs. It has the first operational fly by wire system used in large the Russia. Some one asked me about the mig 31 it basically had a role like the F14. Bla bla bla, the Su27 used some of the tracking computers off the shelf from this plane. It was supposed to have a 200 mile range but was found to be far less but still longer than the F15. It had a very high speed but who really cares. I can go on all day. I know what is what. I know that history has shown that the Americans have the best air power. I imagine it is upsetting always playing second best, but I wouldnt know lol.
Listen I live in Bosnia & Herzegovina use google if you don`t know where it is. Also it seems that you know more than entire Nato staff because they say that there weren`t any S-300 in Yugoslavia. Also Albania was never part of Yugoslavia I know because I was born in Yugoslavia.
By duf 1228298419Thats god you said that. I agree with that and never said that. That air defense network was in Serbia and was used. I google'd it as well and was briefed on it. I dont care because we stomped your equipment once again in that war. It was a tromping. It is history not fiction. Russian avionics are still far behind the US and it is fact. Google the history of the warsaw pact ant it shows that Serbia was one of the drafting nations although they decided to leave the pact early. It is fact not fiction. Yes it must hurt to see all of those former USSR countries begging to join NATO now. In history how many un authorized flights have Russian made over the Continental US? That is a big fat goose egg. How many have we done over the heart of the Soviet Unoin? Many many many. It is known that the g2a defense networks are getting better but are still most ineffective against stealth like aircraft. I know that no matter what history says, you know better. You cant come to wraps with the fact when a US aircraft carrier arrives at a port near your country they have a more powerful airforce than you. Thats just a carrier not a battle division.
Why hasnt Iran stopped the constant US infiltration across its borders to kill terrorist. It was on CNN so its no secret. Why dont they stop our F16 and F18 and even the unmanned drones from bombing those terrorist. Why dont they use the S-300 that they just bought from Russia last year. As for the S-300 used in Serbia it was the S-300a with a broad band doppler with an x band. It was released in a security briefing on CNN. Congress was asking how we allowed a stealth aircraft to be shot down. They explained how and what was used. It was the S-300 wow neat stuff to actually know something.
So when Russia was crying "it will mean war if you attack Serbia" where where they? When we sent US warships to aid Gorgia against Russian ethnic killings why did Russia not use its naval power to stop us? I mean they had a blockade how did our ships make it through? You can be born anywhere it means nothing if you know nothing. The mig 31 was an interceptor by design. It was meant to shoot down american bombers not our fighters. Look at our F15 and F16 record against all of the Russian counter parts. Yes AWACS played a big role in that. Also the better computer power of American air power and better pilots. Saud Arabia shot down several mig 29's with F16s they dont have the AWACS like the US. They shot down two MIG29's and 4 F4A's from Iran. How is that?
I use google all the time to back up my facts. I also use experience and I read a lot. Thats why I babble on so much. I also know that the advent of the Euro fighter and the new delta wing fighter made by the french is the main reason we developed the Rapter. We had to keep up with those planes because France sells weapons to all kinds of countries in the mid east.
How many carriers does the Russian navy have operational? Answer 0. They had a design for one but cant afford it just yet. You can google that if you like. It is known that swarms of cheaper aircraft to over take more advanced aircraft are the greatest threat. Maybe that will be the case against the F22 that was a good argument someone made. When they de-commission an F15 many of them go to storage so maybe they are kept for a large war in the future I dont know. I also know the age of our planes is getting alarming. Cases of wiring rotting away and aircraft loosing electronic control is on the rise. Also the lac of people on both sides that qualify to fly these is on the rise.
we move on to F-22 so good luck finding the raptors
By Dark_Zaraki 1188886875Idiots
F-16 is more for ground support
Mig-29M will kill the F-16
It's F-15 that can Crush the MIG
F-16 is a Cheep $16Mill fighter that U.S. made to sell it sux
are superioir to the mig-29. the only advantage of the f-16 the mig-28 has is HMS (Helmet mounted sight) and maneuverability. but in a war manueverability doesn't matter because if you don't have the speed to keep up with the target you're as good as dead.
By Meak13 1188764503